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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2022 7:20 pm 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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I just made my first recording with the 02R. It took a bit of figuring out how to route the inputs to the busses so i could then rout them to the adat but here we are. It's actually simple and logical. I connected the optical outs to a presonus interface that has adat so the actual digital signal is pure 02R.

All comments welcome.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2022 9:47 am 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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Hey Byron. Could i trouble you to have a listen and comment on the sound? I’m curious if it translates to other gear and ears as your stuff always sounds real good over here. It’s not an original and i did only one take + a second vocal.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:07 pm 
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I'll have a listen.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:28 pm 
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A very heart-felt tune. It has a very comfortable cadence. The sound is right up front. Clear. I might be tempted to back the vocal off just a tiny bit, even though i am a big fan of up-front vocals.

I feel it calling out for a gentle build of some kind - probably some stings - in the middle section. then an outro with just the acoustic, as was the intro.

I find the vocal a bit "boxy", for lack of a more precise descriptor. What mic was used? What, if any EQ did you apply to the vocal?

This was done through your new (old) deck?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 1:42 pm 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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Thank you very much for listening and your cooment. Yes this is the old (new) desk. The mic used is a Rode m2. I don’t use nt2a that often because they also pick up any room sound and even sounds from outside the house. If you say it sounds boxy, do you mean it lacks detail in both highs and lows?

I’ll have to check about eq but i think i used only a low cut. I have a lot of bass in my voice and i am usually close to the mic. I try to record the same as i would sound live.

I did use a highpass and a lowpass on the guitar to bring it to the back a little. I should have delayed the guitar by a couple of ms to set it a little back in the room but i did not do that yet.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 5:09 pm 
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Those sound like good strategies. At what number was the HPF set? I hadn't thought of it, but from other clips you have posted I knew your voice is bass heavy. But this posting not so much.. So perhaps the HPF is too aggresive?? I try two things with vox tracks. First, set the HPF to handle the proximity effect of close mic. Backing off the distance to the mic is a way to control proximity effect, but is not always a good approach as detail is sacrificed. so finding a good spot for the HPF is a good thing to search for. I also regularly use a fairly aggressive, narrow notch (cut) around 630. I find the spot by setting up a super aggressive , narrow spike (add) on the vox eq and then sweeping up and down around the 630 to find where a nasal, unpleasant sound resides. Then I switch that spike (add) into a notch (cut) at that offensive region (perhaps not as aggressively as the spike used to locate the spot). You probably do similarly, and it is worth the effort.

So I would guess the following may help address your needs. !) try gently lowering the HPF to allow a bit more of your natural bass in so as to maintain "colour" in the track 2) find a number around 630 to notch out, eliminating some nasal quality that exists there in many voices. 3) Add a very little, gentle verb on the vox ( I use Plate verbs often on vox).

Are you applying the hpf to a recorded track in post production, or are you HPFing the input during tracking? I leave the HPFing to post, usually. Same for compression usually, but for some voices a bit of compression on the way in works if you know that such a voice will indeed eventually be compressed in a mix. Gentle is the watchword.

Re my comment about vox- guitar balance, rather than backing the vox off, as I suggested, you can compress the guitar to have it sit differently with the vox. this avoids "thinning out" the mix in the search for a good balance. Your suggestion to delay the guitar gently is something i would do too. I try to calculate the number of ms for setting the delay using the calculation of 30,000 / bpm.

Let me know how it goes.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 8:05 pm 
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I tried some of your suggestions. To my ears the difference is minimal although i seem to have gained some clarity. (at the same time i'm checking how good my hearing is compared to others). I think some of the HPF is aplied right after the mike as i'm not sure that the 02R sends this to adat before eq or post eq. I know you have the choice with this machine but i don't know where that is at this time. Then again i had set the HPF at 315Hz which is quite a bit but the recording shows that the lowest incomming is arround 100Hz so it may be set to pre-eq. Also i boosted air arround 6KHz with 5 db for montoring. You may know that singing a vocal with a headphone let's you hear more bass than there actually is. I do use half open cans so that works better than a closed one. The negative is that you can't set it too loud because the mic could pick up the headphone.

Did i tell you i Use Rode M2 for recording vocals? They are live singing mics with a good kidney pattern, most sensitive on the front and almost nothing at the back. It think i mentioned the Nt2a picks up too much environment although they are more detailed and natural sounding. I don't have o vocal boot but i'd like one. Thanks again for your input !

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 11:28 pm 
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I would say that whatever you did is a step in a good direction. I would agree with your comment re clarity.

The second mix seems to have a bit more verb coming through. Do both of these mixes use the same settings except for changes suggested by your interpretation of my suggestions?

Was the 6khz boost applied to the mix that then became the mp3, or was it just in the cans for monitoring ( so in that case there would be no 6 khz boost in the mix? )

If you looked for a notch as i suggested, what number did you find at which to set the notch?

What number is your hpf set at? For tracking I don't often use a hpf. I decide on how much bottom end to carve off during the mix down. For a voice with strong low qualities, such as yours, I generally would not want a hpf above 80 or 100 on the way in. This would address some plosives that may occur and some of the proximity effect. Then during the mix make decisions about carving out the low end. 315 seems a high number ??? on a male vocal. I would want to hear what it sounds like with more low end vocal stuff remaining. If you have filtered on the way in perhaps there is not that information remaining on the track. ?? That is why i leave it to the mix to decide whether to be more or less aggressive with hpf on a vocal.

Did you add any verb or compression to any aspect? to an individual track(s)? an over all wash?

I am still thinking some slow strings during the middle portion would build the song.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2022 6:48 pm 
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A very good song. I agree with Byron. The vocals are just a bit in your face. I know you added some kind of effect. Sounds like maybe a room verb? It could be just as simple as dripping the vocals just a bit. Overall I really enjoy listening.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2022 11:53 am 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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Hi Ron. Thanks for those remarks. I’m gonna try to add the strings as Byron suggested and I may try to redo the vocals. I’m also thinking of recording the vocals with all the different mics i have. I seem to have collected some from cheap up to the nt2a. Could be an interesting experiment.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:49 pm 
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very informative to do such a mic comparison. You may be surprised at th e result.

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