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PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:38 am 
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Lone Star

Joined: Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:26 am
Posts: 4
Favourite food: spaghetti
Machine type: AW16G
Hi, I am looking into buying a second AW16g to link to my current 16g, to increase to 16 inputs. I've wondered if the AW1600 can link to the 16g to achieve this, and then allow for the use of the 1600's USB connection?
Any input on that would be Greatly Appriciated!
RnR


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 7:37 am 
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No More Coasters!
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Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 10:33 pm
Posts: 1794
Machine type: AW1600
I have an AW1600 linked via midi to an AW16G, to give me twice the available tracks.

The set up is fairly easy to do, but I won't detail it all right now. But, if you do get a 1600 I can run through the steps to connect them.

One issue with using an AW1600 with the AW16G, is that you cannot connect the slave ( AW16G ) to the master ( AW1600 ) using the digital out on the AW16g, to the digital input on the AW1600. There is some type of timing conflict ( probably related to the fact that the G uses an optical digital out and the 1600 uses a coaxial digital input. Anyways, if you try to use the digital ins/outs to connect the two, the G and the 1600 will go out of sync.

So, you have to send the audio signal from the 16G to the 1600 by using an analog connection which is: ( stereo/aux out ) 0n the G, to any two analog inputs on the 1600 ( I used 3/4 which I have panned left/right ).

Basically, I do a mix of the tracks on the G, and then send that stereo mix to the two selected inputs on the 1600. Then I mix on the 1600 and blend in the signal coming from the G, to the mix on the 1600. This all happens on the fly and you don't have to assign the two selected inputs on the 1600 ( master ) to tracks on the 1600. The signal outputed from the 16G to the two inputs on the 1600, will record directly to the stereo mixdown....when you do your final mix on the 1600.

It takes a second or two for the two units to sync, so leave some time for the pre-roll when recording. You can record on each unit independently of course, or simultaneously.

If you were recording a band for example with all 16 tracks recording ( 8 on the 1600 and 8 on the 16G ) it would work fine. Once the machines sync ( which takes a second or two ), they'll stay in sync and record everything no problem.

It's not a perfect setup, but it works pretty good once you adapt to some of the quirks ( like the pre-rolling ). Sonically, I don't really notice any issues related to the fact that the G sends it's musical info to the 1600 via an analog connection.

The extra tracks are great to have, and the USB function is terrific to have. As a long time G user before I added the 1600, I can't stress the convenience of the USB connection.

If you have any other questions, let me know. Otherwise, there are some other older threads that you can find via the search function that detail linking two G's or ( 1600/16G ). I read those threads quite a bit, before I added the 1600 to my set-up, but I'm glad I did.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 8:58 am 
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Lone Star

Joined: Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:26 am
Posts: 4
Favourite food: spaghetti
Machine type: AW16G
Thanks Utah, for the Quick response!
Sounds a little complicated, especially without having the Hardware to test it out on! Is it simpler to link two AW16g's? Is the USB output worth the extra effort?
I'll definetly take your advice and check into previous Threads, and will re-post after purchasing a 1600!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 10:50 am 
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No More Coasters!
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Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 10:33 pm
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Machine type: AW1600
I might have made it seem more complicated than it actually is. Connecting the 1600 and 16G together by midi and setting things up, only takes a few seconds.

The difference when using a 1600 with a G, is that the audio output of the G ( set up as a slave ) is transfered via an analog cable, versus a digital one to avoid the audio syncing issue.

I think the rest of the operation is going to be the same whether you're using two G's or a 1600 with a G, but I'm not 100% sure of that. Perhaps two G's would sync together more quickly, eliminating some of the pre-roll necessary to let the 2 machines sync, but maybe not. The pre-roll that's necessary to sync the two machines when playing back or recording, isn't that big of a deal....and I don't find that it presents problems when recording. There might even be a solution to shorten the time it takes for the two machines to sync, that I'm not aware of.

I find it pretty easy to use the two recorders in tandem, so I hope that I didn't give you the wrong impression.

The USB feature is well worth it, and I don't think I could do without it now. The time it takes for me to do a stereo mixdown, and transfer the wav file to the PC for some additional mastering has been cut tremendously, versus the time it would take to burn it to CD to do the transfer. All other tasks, like backing up songs is super quick as well.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:11 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:26 am
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Favourite food: spaghetti
Machine type: AW16G
Finally purchased my 1600, and have several questions,

Is it necessary to run the analog cables from the 16g stereo out into inputs on the 1600 during the recording process?

What is gained in linking the two recorders during the recording process as opposed to running the two seperatly? Anything other then the convienience of starting and stopping from the Master?

I haven't done any recording yet, but have been playing and learning on the Link-Up. I've noticed that the Clocks on the two are different, and the G seems to run faster(?)! After 8 seconds the 1600 has 8.895 on the clock, while the G has 8.90. After 23 seconds the 1600 has 23.831 and the G has 23.823. Is this normal? Is it related to the sync delay that has been mentioned in several posts?

Have our first recording session tomorrow and am really looking forward to testing this set-up!


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:48 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 10:33 pm
Posts: 1794
Machine type: AW1600
Finally purchased my 1600, and have several questions,

Is it necessary to run the analog cables from the 16g stereo out into inputs on the 1600 during the recording process?

No, it's not. But, if you don't.....you're going to need an external mixer to blend the outputs from the G and 1600 together, so that when you're overdubbing....you can monitor all the previously recorded tracks on both machines in your headphones or speakers. I usually don't even turn on my slave ( 16G ), until I need the extra tracks.

What is gained in linking the two recorders during the recording process as opposed to running the two seperatly? Anything other then the convienience of starting and stopping from the Master?

It makes syncing easy, because each time you hit RTZ or play on the master, it syncs up the slave. If you record on each machine separately, without them being connected together via midi....you might have to do more work after the fact to sync all the tracks.

I haven't done any recording yet, but have been playing and learning on the Link-Up. I've noticed that the Clocks on the two are different, and the G seems to run faster(?)! After 8 seconds the 1600 has 8.895 on the clock, while the G has 8.90. After 23 seconds the 1600 has 23.831 and the G has 23.823. Is this normal? Is it related to the sync delay that has been mentioned in several posts?

I've never looked that closely at the counters on each machine to see if their out a few 1000's of a second. All I know is that sonic-ally, both machines stay in sync. The sync issues I mentioned in earlier posts, are related to the digital clock issues when using the digital output of the slave (16G)to connect to the digital input on the master (1600).

Have our first recording session tomorrow and am really looking forward to testing this set-up!

Have fun! One thing that tripped me up early on, was how to set up the slave (G) for recording. It's actually easy, and while you've probably figured it out....here's how to do it. Just enable the recording settings on the slave ( selecting inputs and tracks ), and then press the play and record buttons on the G together. That puts the G on pause...but in record mode. Then hit the play button on the master (1600) and the G will now begin to roll and record, and the 1600 will roll playback and not record (unless it's also set up to record). It takes a few seconds to sync things when recording....so, leave some extra few seconds at the start of your song project.....to give the machines enough time to roll and sync.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:19 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:26 am
Posts: 4
Favourite food: spaghetti
Machine type: AW16G
Thanks again for the input Utah!
I think my first question "Is it necessary to run the analog cables from the 16g stereo out into inputs on the 1600 during the recording process?" wasn't very clear. What I meant is that the G and the 1600 seemed to Sync with just the Midi cable connection. The use of analog cables ties up two inputs on the 1600 during recording. Is that necessary?
Also, I run XP Home Edition SP3 on my computer. I recieved a warning message when installing the USB Midi Drivers, and so I cancelled Install. Is XP Home able to support the AW1600 Midi Drivers?
Really appriciate all the attention you've given:-)


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:08 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 10:33 pm
Posts: 1794
Machine type: AW1600
XP Home should work with the USB midi drivers. I'm using that OS on the computer that my 1600 is connected to.

As for the cable connection question. Yes, connecting the slave to the master will use up two inputs. So, if you need all the inputs to record 8 simultaneous ins on each machine.....don't bother to use up two inputs to connect the slave to the master, during the recording stage. The Midi will keep both machines in sync.

Just connect the outputs/inputs when you need to monitor both machines from the Master (1600), or when you're doing a mixdown on the master, and you're feeding in the submix coming from the slave.

Don't forget, when you do connect the slave to the master (1600) using two analog inputs.....pan the inputs you are using on the 1600 far left and far right, so that you'll hear the tracks on the slave in stereo when monitoring.

When doing your mixdown on the Master (1600), you don't have to assign the two inputs you're using on the 1600 to any tracks. The sound coming from the slave through the two inputs will mixdown directly to the stereo track, when doing a stereo track recording on the 1600. But, you have to have the two inputs panned to the left and right, for your slave tracks to record in stereo on the 1600.

If you have any more questions, just fire away. I record with a G/1600 combo and I'll be happy to try to help you out if I can.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:49 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 2:43 pm
Posts: 233
Location: North of Toronto
Favourite food: Smoothie
Machine type: AW1600
As Utah explained, the setup will work. I can't figure out what the second midi cable does >slave out to master in<. Makes no difference for recording so I yanked it. If you need to keep listening back it's a bit tiring to constantly unplug and reconfigure the ins and outs for playback, then recording again. Perhaps blending the main or stereo outs in an outboard mixer would solve that. Or a second set of speaks for the other machine?

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