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 Post subject: acoustic 12 string
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 4:19 pm 
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Tinhorn
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Location: Im in NH, where men are men & sheep run fast.
Ive been using it on every tune Im doing for my cd....Im nuts over the sound.
I have an Alvarez, low to middle end quality, nothing spectacular.
I tried a couple diff acoustic pickups and they all change the sound of the guitar completely, the actual sound the instrument produces is NOT replicated by these pickups in the least in my humble and often warped opinion.
Im recording w a very basic Nady microphone on a stand pointed right at the sound hole about 4-5inches away, MF sold these mics in a set of 3 for 60 clams.

the sound i get by micing is absolutely astounding, I do send the mic through a sweet behrry preamp but nothing else really, totally dry and it comes out just perfect.
The only drwback is that I need to stay perfectly still so as not to cause any dynamics issues.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 5:04 pm 
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Ultra Botkiller
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Location: Where the big toe goes... the foot will follow...
There is always going to be some coloration when using a mic.

I actually use 3 pickups when I record acoustic guitar. Each pickup goes to its own track for use in post production.

Fishman Piezo
Fishman Custom Rare Earth Blender [Condensor mic/magnetic]

The Condensor mic give rich mic'd tones and captures finger noises too.
The Piezo captures low tones well.
The Magnetic captures higher tones and overtones/harmonics.

You can then add delay, reverb, chorus to different tracks to your liking or simply blend/mix all 3.

Cin

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 6:55 pm 
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Tinhorn
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CindaP wrote:
There is always going to be some coloration when using a mic.

I actually use 3 pickups when I record acoustic guitar. Each pickup goes to its own track for use in post production.

Fishman Piezo
Fishman Custom Rare Earth Blender [Condensor mic/magnetic]

The Condensor mic give rich mic'd tones and captures finger noises too.
The Piezo captures low tones well.
The Magnetic captures higher tones and overtones/harmonics.

You can then add delay, reverb, chorus to different tracks to your liking or simply blend/mix all 3.

Cin


HMMM...i had all those pickups and gave them all away, i hated the sounds.
Im not sure I follow you w the coloration thing.
Im trying to say I feel that micing is capturing the overall tones of the axe far better than the pickups.

your saying the opposite?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:05 pm 
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I think she's saying that since the sound of the 12 string is so complex, you get different parts of the sound out from the different pickups and mics, that no one mic or pickup can capture all the sound. .

when you hear the guitar live, you are hearing the top of the guitar, the strings themselves, the back of the guitar, the reflections inside the body, and various parts of the top are vibrating at different rates with phase cancelation and such. Very hard to get all that with one mic.

And that you then blend them together in an attempt to get that orginal rich sound

Or not


Last edited by CareyCorson on Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:08 pm 
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Tinhorn
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CareyCorson wrote:
I think she's saying that since the sound of the 12 string is so complex, you get different parts of the sound out from the different pickups and mics, that no one mic or pickup can capture all the sound. And that you then blend them together in an attempt to get that orginal rich sound.

Or not


ahh, yes the opposite. :lol:
gotcha.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:10 pm 
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Location: Where the big toe goes... the foot will follow...
Yeah... I was saying that... AND...

All mics, just like pickups make the guitar sound different.

That's why there are ribbon mics and large diaphragm mics... etc. etc. etc.

They even make mic emulators because certain mics color/adjust the tone in certain predictable ways.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:14 pm 
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Tinhorn
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Location: Im in NH, where men are men & sheep run fast.
CindaP wrote:
Yeah... I was saying that... AND...

All mics, just like pickups make the guitar sound different.

That's why there are ribbon mics and large diaphragm mics... etc. etc. etc.

They even make mic emulators because certain mics color/adjust the tone in certain predictable ways.


i understand all that cinda.


my only point in this thread thats supposed to be nothing more than a "tip" to begin with is this:

Im getting better results recording my inexpensive 12 string w a mic than I did w acoustic pickups.
I feel the pickups transform the tone to a more electric sound than they should....and the mics arent doing that.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:17 pm 
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But I think a tip could be "you don't have to chose "either/or", you can blend together pickups and mics" (you've got 16 tracks)

But your point about using the mic over the pickups, is a good one


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:23 pm 
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Tinhorn
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Location: Im in NH, where men are men & sheep run fast.
CareyCorson wrote:
But I think a tip could be "you don't have to chose "either/or", you can blend together pickups and mics" (you've got 16 tracks)

But your point about using the mic over the pickups, is a good one



well now ....i guess that certainly could be a tip.


but its not a tip from me.


Is it me or does it say "post any tips or tricks "under the description of this forum?

So i do that, and get a lesson on the basics of microphones.


Boy that'll teach me. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Hmmmm
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:39 pm 
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I had thought this section was to:

Quote:
"post any tips or tricks"


Recording tips are like assh...er....opinions, everybody has one, not everything works for everybody.

There are a ton of orthodox methods that work.

There are a few unorthodox methods that work as well.

I didn't perceive it as an opportunity to compete over who has more knowledge, but to share what you got.

In the end analysis, these tips are written for users of all levels, those who have a lot of experience and knowledge and those who might need a basic microphone primer for instance.

One solution could be for everyone to post their tip, along with some of their results and allow the listener to decide what best suits their recording situation.

Rant over, please return to your desired programming. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Hmmmm
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:42 pm 
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Tinhorn
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'61 wrote:
I had thought this section was to:

Quote:
"post any tips or tricks"



Rant over, please return to your desired programming. :wink:



I cant, teletubbies isnt on today. :cry:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 9:25 pm 
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Location: Where the big toe goes... the foot will follow...
For the record... I was not suggesting that you buy $300 worth of guitar pickups in order to get the sound that you achieve.

I was simply remaking on how I generally record acoustic guitar.

I'm also a fan of micing. I've been known to use a pair of Samson C02s as well.

So, let me try again...

What types of dynamic issues do you encounter when you move?

Cin

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Trying to play nice with others... honest.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 9:34 pm 
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Tinhorn
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Location: Im in NH, where men are men & sheep run fast.
CindaP wrote:
For the record... I was not suggesting that you buy $300 worth of guitar pickups in order to get the sound that you achieve.

I was simply remaking on how I generally record acoustic guitar.

I'm also a fan of micing. I've been known to use a pair of Samson C02s as well.

So, let me try again...

What types of dynamic issues do you encounter when you move?

Cin

----------------------------------------------
Trying to play nice with others... honest.




why Im glad you asked..... Basically my massive girth creates gobs of standing waves throughout the room that move about as if someone was waving a sheet of plywood around.....Its horrible.






:lol:




no really i mean just keeping the distance from the soundhole to the mic[s] exactly the same the entire time recording.....no "rockin out" permitted. :lol:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 2:08 am 
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Mr. Electonica Dude
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Damn , I missed Tele Tubbies today! O well the above was just as entertaining. :lol:

Actually my sides are still sore!

msg

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 2:20 am 
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Calf Cutter
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I bring drivel with me wherever I go. 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:07 am 
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Roper
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I eat my bass. wrote:
why Im glad you asked..... Basically my massive girth creates gobs of standing waves throughout the room that move about as if someone was waving a sheet of plywood around.....Its horrible.

:lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:
You got it all wrong, Eat. You're a gobo on feet that eliminates standing waves :!:

Too funny :!:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:59 am 
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Mr. Electonica Dude
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60's guy wrote:
[You're a gobo on feet



:laughing3: Suuweet!

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Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 7:42 pm 
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Tinhorn
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Location: Im in NH, where men are men & sheep run fast.
mrskygod wrote:
60's guy wrote:
[You're a gobo on feet



:laughing3: Suuweet!


well, they serve primarily health food, But i guess it works.
Image

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