The DijonStock Digital Home Recording Support Forum

*** USER REGISTRATION DISABLED! FOR ACCESS TO THE BOARD, MAIL TO registration AT dijonstock DOT com. THANK YOU ***
It is currently Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:32 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 5:12 am 
Offline
Website Slayer and Problem Solver
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:28 am
Posts: 1259
Location: 1/2 Central CA Coast; 1/2 RVing
Machine type: AW1600
I'm not a "fader jockey" when I do mixes. Also, rarely use scenes. Consequently, my mixes lack some dynamics in instrument levels changing throughout the song.

I'm curious how one uses these fancy motorized faders. I assume the movements are recorded during a mix and can be played back for a subsequent mix. If one wanted to change the fader movements in one small part of the prerecorded events, is it possible to "punch in" like audio?

Somewhat a change in the subject, but I'll ask it anyway. Couldn't I record and playback fader movements by using a PC with a MIDI sequencer to capture (and send later) fader related MIDI info sent by the AW1600 during a mix?

Thanks,

_________________
Ralph (aka The Head Hog)
"What's Time to a Hog?"
Hog Time Music Website - My Songs on Soundclick -


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 6:01 am 
Offline
Mr. Electonica Dude
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:48 am
Posts: 11452
Location: Godly Taxas
Favourite food: Frog Legs
Machine type: AW4416
In a nutshell Ralph , the answer is yes and yes.

The 4416 and 2400 record fader movements for a whole song or any portion therof. Not only faders , but pans and effects changes of anykind can be "recorded". These recorded real time motions of parameters is called an automix. It does require the creation of at least one scene . You can even fade one scene into another over any time frame. How is that for powerful ?

Midi can do the same thing but it involves recording the midi equivelent of the above to a sequencer that is synced to the audio track via MTC. That's how I automated my 16G until I got my 4416s.

A step even way beyond the two previous methods is to drop the tracks into a software DAW like Sonar etc. Not only can audio be automated but midi as well and they are seamless as they hold hands in your project.

Hope this helps some.

msg

_________________
THE MUSIC IS DOWN IN HERE
____________________________________________________

Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:02 am 
Offline
Mr. Blues
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:51 pm
Posts: 3371
Location: Germany
Favourite food: Sauerkraut ;-)
Machine type: AW2400
Hi Ralph,

what Geno said ....

Let me add, that it is pretty easy and comfortable to record with autoscenes.
You also have the possibilitiy with the aw2400 (dont know for the 4416) to save this automixes as different automix-scenes (up to 10).

HTH
Andreas

_________________
Blues aint nothing but the blues!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:08 pm 
Offline
Spaminator Extraordinaire
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2004 10:58 pm
Posts: 8190
Favourite food: sushi
Machine type: AW2400
The auto faders are the greatest thing period about the 2400. What used to be a laborious and notebook filled mess at mix down, is now a leasurely walk through the park. You can just set it and forget it. Thanks to Andreas, I have come to love the auto process. As Geno mentioned you can also use the pan and effects as well. Best part, you don't press the red button at all. When you finish, you can either accept your mix or reject it which means no undo's, no worries.

You can fine tune each volume level one fader at a time anywhere in your mix. First save a scene of your current settings. Hit the auto mix button, set it to enable, make sure faders are highlighted in the screen, arm it in the auto fader section and press play. Any adjustments you make will be repeated almost like a ghost mixing for you. People who have seen the playback with the autofader enabled, have literally done a double take.

It's fantastic.

_________________
GSMUSIC: Hey RZ, Im not no upper class american, the gear I own is what I have special to me. My car sucks, my house sucks, my nieghborhood sucks. Does yours RZ? Does it?

rz-land


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 5:36 pm 
Offline
Website Slayer and Problem Solver
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:28 am
Posts: 1259
Location: 1/2 Central CA Coast; 1/2 RVing
Machine type: AW1600
Thanks for the info! I think I'll try the PC MIDI sequencer approach first, before springing for another recorder. :)

Fade on,

_________________
Ralph (aka The Head Hog)
"What's Time to a Hog?"
Hog Time Music Website - My Songs on Soundclick -


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:00 pm 
Offline
Marker Magician
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:20 pm
Posts: 3469
Machine type: AW2400
motorized faders and the recording of parameter moves (Automix) certainly do change the workflow. I am not sure it saves time - as the recording of mix moves is done in real time on the AW, So it actually increases the time you put in, but you can "get it right" and then it stays that way until you tell it to do something different. I would think that the midi approach would be useful, but too much for my small brain at this stage. glad I got the 2400 (with Automix) there are some still around I have heard ....

_________________
Byron


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:13 am 
Offline
Footswitch Genius
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:54 am
Posts: 536
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Favourite food: Jarlsberg
Machine type: AW16G
Quote:
I would think that the midi approach would be useful

it's more of a means to an end than 'useful' - you have to avoid MIDI loops, i.e. you want the faders to send MIDI on record, but not receive it. on playback you want them only to receive it - something that is impossible to achieve on my pox-ridden scuzzbucket pisstake E-Magic MT4 interface due to its auto-patching 'feature' (read: intentional bug) which means physically switching the cables around so there's only a one-way transfer, otherwise as you adjust it the LCD fader erratically jumps between 0 and where the physical fader level is

one good thing about it though is in Sonar you can draw in the mixdown envelopes for the entire tracks and adjust them with your mouse. i think i'd still prefer the G to have motorised faders though

_________________
Wanted to buy: one Right Word Clock, in good condition.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:19 am 
Offline
Mr. Electonica Dude
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:48 am
Posts: 11452
Location: Godly Taxas
Favourite food: Frog Legs
Machine type: AW4416
Quote:
you have to avoid MIDI loops


Very true

Quote:
you want the faders to send MIDI on record, but not receive it. on playback you want them only to receive it


Mind clarifying that ?

With USB or Firewire you can TX/RX midi till the world looks flat in Sonar PEVer.6 without changin nuthin. Send / Recieve /record / monitor or any combination thereof.

The sequencer can be any midi channel and they are virtually limitless in most software DAWs.

msg

_________________
THE MUSIC IS DOWN IN HERE
____________________________________________________

Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:14 am 
Offline
Footswitch Genius
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:54 am
Posts: 536
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Favourite food: Jarlsberg
Machine type: AW16G
Quote:
Mind clarifying that ?

ah sorry, it refers back to my previous statement about MIDI loops, and might only apply to my piece'o'shit Emagic MT4 interface, which interprets certain MIDI events as an excuse to change its internal patch config. - after much searching for a fix on the web, the universal opinion seems to be "buy a new non-Emagic interface, then smash the f*ck out of the Emagic MT4 with a large hammer" and as soon as i find a suitable 2-in 4-out MOTU or similar unit i can afford, i intend to do just that**

to record AW16 faders to Sonar, i have MIDI out of the AW into the MIDI in of the PC and have to unplug the cable going from AW16-in to PC-out, or i get the MIDI loop jittery fader situation described before.

playback's not so bad, which is lucky because i need the AW-out to PC-in to sync the PC slave to the AW master

--------------------------------
**here's some MT4 'user reviews':

"My worst investment so far. Since I am working mainly with Sysex and Realtime messages, it is not worth a penny for what it claims to be. I am so MAD at Emagic. Probably I will smash that f&!& ting with a hammer. Seriously"

"F*CK !!! When you send Sysex message through it, it switches automatically to so called 'patch' mode, which in simple English means you can't use it for Realtime and System messages. WHAT A SHIT EMAGIC?!?!?!?!? "

"This little box can be a real pain."

"Uses the same technology as the AMT8? What a lie.."

etc. etc.


_________________
Wanted to buy: one Right Word Clock, in good condition.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 9:51 pm 
Offline
Spaminator Extraordinaire
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2004 10:58 pm
Posts: 8190
Favourite food: sushi
Machine type: AW2400
Just for fun, I threw together a quick video on You Tube of the AW2400 faders at work.


Link

_________________
GSMUSIC: Hey RZ, Im not no upper class american, the gear I own is what I have special to me. My car sucks, my house sucks, my nieghborhood sucks. Does yours RZ? Does it?

rz-land


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:51 pm 
Offline
Robbie The Botkiller
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:46 pm
Posts: 5105
Location: Netherlands
Favourite food: Ria's cheesecake
Machine type: AW16G
Ria: "Is that Ron? He has such a sexy voice!"

:lol:

Can you have them make a shifted sine wave? That would be so cool.

_________________

Don't judge the coffee by its cup.
The proof of the cheese is in the eating


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:19 pm 
Offline
Mr. Blues
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:51 pm
Posts: 3371
Location: Germany
Favourite food: Sauerkraut ;-)
Machine type: AW2400
Hi nRobbie,

Robbie wrote:
Ria: "Is that Ron? He has such a sexy voice!"

:lol:



thank you for the warning. Read it and watched the video without sound when Astrid was here too. :mrgreen:

@Ron: well done video. Dancing faders rules!

Andreas

_________________
Blues aint nothing but the blues!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 1:19 am 
Offline
Website Slayer and Problem Solver
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:28 am
Posts: 1259
Location: 1/2 Central CA Coast; 1/2 RVing
Machine type: AW1600
Now I REALLY want one! :)

_________________
Ralph (aka The Head Hog)
"What's Time to a Hog?"
Hog Time Music Website - My Songs on Soundclick -


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 

All times are UTC + 1 hour [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group