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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 11:46 am 
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Harry the Spaceman
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Hi Guys

The snare drum always sounds distant. I can put that SM57 wherever I like and it never sounds thick and thwacky. To be fair, my drummer does play it in a manner that causes it to sound rather thin and tricky anyway, but what can I do to get the snare to sound like a good solid cracker!?

I can post a sample if anyone wants to give it a go?

art


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:47 pm 
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Robbie The Botkiller
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Give the drummer some EPO. :oops:

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

Tudan is probably the person that could help. He is very experienced.

Calling Tudan, come in Tudan, Earth calling Tudan...


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:51 pm 
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Harry the Spaceman
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He he he, thanks Robbie... ;)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:53 pm 
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Wants You
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Quote:
my drummer does play it in a manner that causes it to sound rather thin and tricky anyway


uh....


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:09 pm 
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Is it just the way the drummer plays, or is the snare itself needing a little help? If somebody hits it like they mean it does it sound good?

I'd start by messing with the snare (tuning, different head, even different snare). Then ask your drummer to hit it like it matters. Have you tried miking the bottom?

If none of these get you there I'd start messing with EQ and compression on the recorded track. You can find the "crack" frequency range and boost that. You can also cut any frequencies that are muddying up things. Something in here might help:

http://www.digitalprosound.com/2002/03_mar/tutorials/mixing_excerpt1.htm

Regarding compression, you can set a slow attack and then compress the rest of the drum hit. In theory, this will let the initial transient through but clamp down on the decay, resulting in a sharper snare hit. I've tried this and not had much luck with it, but it's a common approach from what I can gather - worth a try.

If all else fails you can find a way to use the recorded snare hits to trigger a sample of a snare hit that you like. Can't help you there as to how to go about this, though.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:31 pm 
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Harry the Spaceman
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Heya JM!

Thanks... Its actually a great snare, Pearl Omar Hakim, tuned by Neil Ettridge. so the drum is awesome. it speaks well, just records a little nassally.

I think I'm really looking for a nice EQ for it more than anything.

Will take a look at the article.

Thanks again!!!
art


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:42 pm 
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Harry the Spaceman
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he he he, funny how just trying whats being suggested works...

narrow notch 900Hz -8 dB

much nicer.
somehow sounds thicker when I REMOVE that range... WIERD.

art


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 7:22 pm 
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Tenderfoot
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A 57 could be contributing to the nasal quantity too...try something with a little mid/lower mid thwack, even a 58, just to see if there is any difference. Also, are you using an outboard preamp?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:54 am 
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Harry the Spaceman
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Hiya Stacy

No such luxury. SM57 straight to the G. I do have a Beyerdynamic with better bottom end, especially when in the 'Proximity Effect' field. Perhaps swap them out as the Beyerdynamic is currently my guitar amp mic.

Thanks!
art


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:17 am 
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Guitar Ho
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A gate properly set can also work wonders.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:36 am 
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Harry the Spaceman
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Thanks DC!

I try to gate the drums, because we have a lot of bleed. But Dylan plays so many ghost notes its a pain in the @$$! :)

Is it worth working hard at, cause I'm not afraid, but I'd like to know it pays off... Got any nice settings in mind?

art


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:46 am 
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Guitar Ho
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It depends on the tempo of the song, Art. You want that gate to close before the next hit of the snare, which is of course following tempo. You want it to open fast to catch the transient, and then close relatively quickly but not too quick. Each song is going to be different...no magic bullet I'm afraid.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:02 am 
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Harry the Spaceman
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Okay, thanks DC, always appreciated. I'll get cracking on that right now. Okay, first self inflicted pitfall...

The hats aren't mic'd seperately, and they are crucial to the mix. So I will have to do another take. Gating the Hats/Snare track is not working out so nicely.

art


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 12:44 pm 
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Guitar Ho
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It depends on the tempo of the song, Art. You want that gate to close before the next hit of the snare, which is of course following tempo. You want it to open fast to catch the transient, and then close relatively quickly but not too quick. Each song is going to be different...no magic bullet I'm afraid.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 12:45 pm 
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Guitar Ho
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That message above has been waiting since the forum was timing out. Grrrrr...

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:14 am 
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As stated above, you have to make sure the drummer hits the drums properly.

I did a live recording of a band where the drummer was using "hot rods" so as not to be too loud live - consequently the signals for recording were totally hopeless. I had to do all sorts of things to try and get something which still sounds crap. For example on some tracks I had to use an expander, then record to another channel and compress. Others I had to gate which removed the ghost hits.

Oh yeah - a good drum kit helps too.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:01 am 
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I have learned the importance of using both gates and compression to make the drums sound tighter with a better pop.

The easiest way to do this is to get a drum machine and find a patch that matches the way that your drum sounds. You may have to run it through EQ in order to get the sound that you're looking for.

Then, loop the crack of the snare.

Tune the compression and gate to taste.

I've learned that even with electronic drums, adding compression with give the drum that studio splash that you're looking for.

Cin

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