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PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:55 pm 
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Tinhorn

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:33 pm
Posts: 276
Favourite food: Jägerschnitzel
Machine type: AW16G
Fellas,

I have been listening to Ukrainian folk songs on youtube (don't laugh, now!) and I have noticed these tempo increases on many tunes. I have a Russian-ish tune I would like to do this with, but I don't know how. The aw16g has a tempo page where you set the initial tempo and that's all she wrote, as far as I can tell. My drum machine (Boss DR 880 can change tempos with the patterns but the Yamaha would seem to preclude that. Any ideas?

Thanks and cheers,
Randy

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:37 am 
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Marker Magician
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Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:20 pm
Posts: 3768
Machine type: AW2400
The tempo map can be made to do tempo changes, but only to the click track. You have to perform/record the music to the change in tempo. It is not like some modern DAW where a change in the designated tempo will increase/decrease the playback of the song ( if that is so specified in the DAWs preferences.) All the Aw machines are similar and will not do that. What will happen is that the measure/beat count of the display will change when so specified in a new Tempo map instruction. You can also switch scenes on the fly with a tempo map instruction.

Maybe that answers your question, but ask again if not.

there are certain pitfalls using the tempo map to change scenes. In a nutshell you have to realize that if you tweak stuff in scene one, any change that will continue throughout the piece, such as increasing the level of one or some of the instruments or vocals ... you must then make and save that tweak in every scene ... no global tweek facility. When it comes to polishing a song after you have brilliantly designed multiple scene changes during post production and need to make final adjustments to compressors EQ settings verb levels etc, etc, that can be a real thorn in getting it as you want it to be.

The 2400 and 4416 have automix facility which makes tempo map scene changes unnecessary. but actual tempo changes work the same on both machines -- alter the measure/beat count display and boost the rate of a click when turned on.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 11:20 pm 
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Tinhorn

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:33 pm
Posts: 276
Favourite food: Jägerschnitzel
Machine type: AW16G
Hey Byron,

I see what you mean. I have never used the tempo map for anything; it's sort of like those channel functions in Photoshop that are baked into the software but are otherwise written in linear A and defy easy grasp.

I know that I can "increase tempo" on my drum track by halving or quartering the beat; that's not the same thing as a smooth ramp up in tempo, but I may attempt it.

This is, of course, quite different from the phenomena we have all experienced where you count in the tune or play the intro and then the drummer, independently, decides to increase the tempo by 15 BPM when he comes in.

Hope all is well with you and yours,
Randy

P.S. Did I tell you that I picked up another aw16g? I haven't even taken it out of the case, but I figure that I will at some point, when the soft keys on the current unit (#2) start to get glitchy. Why do I not upgrade to contemporary, computer-based recording solutions? Dunno. I like the G and I know (sort of half-assed, true) how to run it. Additionally, it offers high fidelity; high enough for my purposes, at any rate. But thank God for the Dijonstock forum!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:50 am 
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Marker Magician
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Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:20 pm
Posts: 3768
Machine type: AW2400
Now there is ramping up in tempo and then there is speeding up. (And there is starting too fast, as you suggested). And there is steady tempo, as it should be in most instances. Tempo is an all important aspect.in performance and hence recording. I am a proponent of the click track in the studio. Editing is much facilitated if the bed track(s) is/are to a click. tracks building on can often be played to that bed track only, rather than to the click with the bed track, allowing a bit more freedom for interpretation and expression, within the structure of the bed track but not so regimented as to the precise click.

Never hurts to have a spare. I heard a strange noise from my 2400 for the first time yesterday. It was coming from one of the motorized faders I think, during an auto mix run. Went away and i hope it does not come back. I have actually heard it twice!!

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 10, 2021 9:32 pm 
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Tinhorn

Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:33 pm
Posts: 276
Favourite food: Jägerschnitzel
Machine type: AW16G
My goal would be to ramp up the tempo, but I can't think of a way to do it with the means at hand. I may try snare drum on the quarter note followed by snare on eighth notes etc. I may also peruse my drum machine's presets to see if something could be modified to suit my intent.

I have never used a click track on the g since I always record my drum track first; it's a complete drum track that I have built on the DR-880. I just do a stereo recording on 15/16. Then I'll play a rhythm guitar part to make sure I'm satisfied with the drum parts. If that is the case I go back and record each drum part, e.g. kick, snare, hi-hat etc. to a separate track. I mix these into stereo and save the scene. Then I move up to the next virtual track and start overdubbing. Pretty much what most folks do with a drum machine, I suppose. But my point is that everything from the start is cued to the electronic drum track. I use the g as master and the DR 880 as slave so that I can go back and make corrections to individual drum parts later if need be.

My only experience with studio recording didn't utilize a click track, if I recall. But the drummer was one of Danny Gatton's drummers and his tempo was very good.

Cheers, Randy

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 4:00 pm 
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Marker Magician
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Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:20 pm
Posts: 3768
Machine type: AW2400
You are essentially working to a click, using a drum machine locked to the tempo you choose. Much easier to lock on as you are tracking. Simple tic toc clicks are easy to get away from. I usually start with a drum track of some sort too. but i refer to that as the click. To me, a click means recording the bed track(s) to a steady tempo and then building from there within the framework established.

As for altering the tempo mid stream. You might consider a dead stop, (if your composition works with that concept) and then a pick up at the new tempo. ??

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