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 Post subject: Filters?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:35 am 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
Sometimes I need all 4 track channel eq bands,so I was wondering
if It's ok to use my high pass and low pass filters on my input
channel eq at the time of recording or would it be better to bounce them to another track after using the filters to free up the 4 eq channels?


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 Post subject: Re: Filters?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:03 am 
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Mr. Electonica Dude
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Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:48 am
Posts: 11452
Location: Godly Taxas
Favourite food: Frog Legs
Machine type: AW4416
Holley wrote:
Sometimes I need all 4 track channel eq bands,so I was wondering
if It's ok to use my high pass and low pass filters on my input
channel eq at the time of recording or would it be better to bounce them to another track after using the filters to free up the 4 eq channels?


A little confused here but the way I read this , you want to cut the extreme lows and highs going into the recorder and then use all four parametric bands to further tweak the vocal?

You can easily do that without bouncing unless you want the vocals printed before mixdown. Personally , I would leave the final tweak for mixdown in case the vocal doesn't quite cut or needs that final sparkling touch in the final mix.

msg

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:35 am 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
Yep you understood me
I 've never used any Eq or compression on my imput channels
for vocals.
I'm famous for doing things the hard way and just wondered what
the best sequence for EQ/Comp was in regards to the Filters..
Sometimes i get lucky and my songs sound really good,but
it must either be the style of song,or maybe the key,but probably
just dumb luck..
I can't really explain without a reference book next to me why
I set my EQ/Comp the way I do..
Writing the songs is the easy part,getting them to sound like you
hear them in you're head is another story..
I'm pretty sure I'm not telling you anything you don't already know...
I find this to be so frustating but so addicting...
I work afternoon shift and can't wait to get home most everynight and go into my studio and try some more!

I'm just glad I haven't added all the hours I've spent mixing!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:09 am 
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Mr. Electonica Dude
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Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:48 am
Posts: 11452
Location: Godly Taxas
Favourite food: Frog Legs
Machine type: AW4416
Holley wrote:
I'm just glad I haven't added all the hours I've spent mixing!


That's always been the hard for me too. It's always crap like "I wonder how this would sound with X msec. delay on this side and stage reverb on the other"

There's certainly nothing wrong with running those basic filters going in. Especially if you have low or high frequency noise or vibrations and you don't want it printed. Often , if I have a hum or some noise that shows up on the RTA that doesn't belong then I will make up a notch filter for that freq , make a second copy of the track and apply the filter to make sure the filter doesn't take away from the original sound in excess. If it does , I erase the copy and live with it. If it doen't I erase the original and go on.

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THE MUSIC IS DOWN IN HERE
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Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:25 am 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
I had joined a band after(20 years) of not playing and got interested in recording because our bass player played me a bunch of songs he'd recorded over the years,He has a Roland 8 Track..So I went out and bought my machine and was trying so hard to write songs for the band
that I never took the time to learn the basics of my machine,With
learning the cover tunes for the band ,writing,recording,mixing I should
have slowed down long enough to experiment with the knobs more..
Now a couple of years later I've written probably 40 some songs,and
probably a third of them need more TLC.
I guess it's called trying to run before you walk!!

Thanks for you're help
Jim


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 10:38 am 
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Tenderfoot
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Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:37 am
Posts: 516
Location: Australia
Machine type: AW2400
Holley,

I no longer gig and recording has given me a whole new musical outlook. I think I have come a long way in writing, arranging, and production in the three years I have owned the G and look forward to trading some tips with you as we go along.

Welcome


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 4:04 am 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
Your very words sound like they could have came out of my mouth..
I am no longer a part of a live band.
We have a unusual set-up
I still record with my old band,but they've replaced me
for the live stuff and my replacement has nothing to do with
the recordings..Two separate band names too...

We have recorded 2 cd's of originals,and only ever played a
handful of them live...
If we would have been more interested in pushing our originals
I probably would have stayed..

We had a huge set list of well over 100 songs (mostly 60's rock)
and tryin to remember all of them took to much away from my
recording.

It gets crazier..
There are 3 writers in the band
and almost no collaberation on each others songs..
So what tends to happen is each person seems to become more interested in their own songs than the others

I feel like if we wrote some things together,we would embrace
all the songs a little more...
So I guess we're really not a band..Just 3 frustrated song writers

Time is a big part of the problem too
We all have jobs and record every chance we get,and in all reality
probably get more done apart than we would together.
I'm fortunate enough to be able to play all the instruments to
complete my recordings...
But my drumming is always canned or played on my keys or Roland Synth
and a stuggle ,like getting my vocals right....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 10:19 am 
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Guitar Ho
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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2004 10:25 pm
Posts: 7793
Location: A la belle Côte d'Azur sans chaussettes
Machine type: Other - please inform admin
Ah, to be young again and completely irresponsable.

I've come to believe that a group is not a democracy. It may be a social contract, but that's as good as it gets. Rare it is where there is more than one with true talent that share mutual objectives such that they lay their individual egos aside.

Technology hasn't helped the situation either. What I see is that more and more, musicians are isolating themselves. In the past, there where no drum machines, no programmable synthetic automation and cetainly no multitrack recording accessible to the masses. By necessity, people had to make music together.

But it's more than just that. It is the death of the band. I did a little bit of research a while back, and counted the number of bands in the top 40 between the years...oh I don't remember now...1984 and 2004 or something like that. The difference in the ratio between individual artists and groups was astounding. Something like 30 to 2.

Something is happening to our social order, and I'm not sure that it's just because of technology.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:10 am 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
I found my Band experience to be highly diappointing..
I joined a band that had a past and re-formed after
a 10 yr. break.They had played in the late 70's & 80's
That was my first band since 1967(Am I dating Myself?)

It was all exiting at first putting enough songs together to
play out ..Then everyone seemed to get complacent and
then everything became repetitious.
We practiced less & played more,and tried to play anything
that anyone requested whether we knew it or not..
The guys were all good players,but we weren't very tight at times..
Everyone sang .so they were all worried about getting their
song in at each gig..
I always felt that the egos were bubbling under the surface
at all times...

Yes.I'm one of those musicians that has isolated himself somewhat..
I want to know that I don't have to depend on anyone too much..
I don't know if thats good or bad ,but it's a little safer in my mind..


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:02 am 
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Tenderfoot
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Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:37 am
Posts: 516
Location: Australia
Machine type: AW2400
Holley,

don't get too hung up on the isolation issue. It has its benefits. I too am a one man band because I'm essentially a songwriter and need to crystallize my ideas. I am an average? singer, bass player, and keyboardist and a bit above average guitar player. I have learned so much by extending myself. Recording is so forgiving - I could never do what I do live. For example, I've started toying with brass arrangements. I'm really enjoying this! Viva La G.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:33 pm 
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Boot Polisher

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:40 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Michigan
My band days are probably over for good..
I hung in there for 3 1/2 years .
I think I'm a lot better guitar player thanks to recording
than I would have been just gigging..

In a cover band ,You're not breaking any new ground
just playing the same stuff over & over again

It seems when you play something musically challenging
the crowd doesn't really care. They only want to hear the
same standard bar songs wherever you go..
(Brown Eyed Girl,Mustang Sally,Old Time Rock & Roll, etc.)

It's funny but I've written songs with driving guitar solos in
them,but I seem to be most proud of the ones that I feel
I wrote good lyrics for or played a instument or style that
isn't what I'm best at.. I guess it's the challenge...

I have a Roland guitar synth and played flutes and violins
on my last one ,I can't be a good judge on how
good the song is,but I sure love the sound of those instuments together....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 1:15 am 
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Poco fan
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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2004 9:45 pm
Posts: 2174
Location: Orangevale, CA
Machine type: AW16G
Great subject about isolation. I quit my band 3 1/2 years ago. I got sick of the egos and playing in bars to drunks. Plus, grandchildren have brought me great joy and thus my priorities have changed. Now I play a couple of times a year with an old band I was in from Arizona and a band that plays at our company's annual conference. Each time, I remember how nice it is to play with other musicians and at the same time how glad I am I don't play with them regularly. So, this forum provides me with enough comraderie, at least for now. And I still get to make music at home and if I screw up, there's no one else to blame but me. :D

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