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 Post subject: Sound Width
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:10 pm 
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Lone Star

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:11 pm
Posts: 7
Hi all,

Ive had my G for about 10 years & this is my 1st post.

I'll try & explain what I am trying to achieve on my recordings:

I record Indie Rock Type music.

You know when you listen to an album from a modern Indie Rock band like Coldplay or Kings of Leon etc, the keyboard recording / sound is spread out over the two speakers.
Only one Instrument is recorded & it fills out the two speakers.

Ive tried to use a stereo track (9/10).
When I record my keys to track 9, copy & paste it to track 10 & then pan
Track 9 to L16 & Track 10 to R16 it just sounds like a mono track (sound is straight down the middle), Im not getting that real stereo sound.

I've listened to other musicians recordings on the G & they seem to be able to acheive that wide sound from recording one instrument to one track.

My problem also applies to recording the Drum Machine, bass, guitars etc.

What am I overlooking???

Cheers


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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:44 pm 
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Robbie The Botkiller
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Hi Retuned and welcome to the forum!

You say you record to track 9 and copy to track 10. Assuming it's a mono signal this is a good thing to do as it is the first step to a wider image: you can edit one of the two tracks to insert a few milliseconds to the very beginning. Make sure one track is panned hard left and the other hard right. It's a matter of experiment to determine how many ms it should be, but 10 ms is a good starting point.

I must say I'm a bit surprised as most keyboards give a stereo signal that you can record to 9 and 10 in one go.

Hope this helps!

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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:08 pm 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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Hi Retuned ! Welcome.

As Robbie said. Copy a track to a second on and panning are only the first two steps. Next push edit untill you see MOVE highlighted. Choose either track, select the track and then set the start measure to zero and the end to as many measures as you have recorded. Then set the amount of adjustment to 010. Execute, return to zero and play. The track should open up. Move is explained on page 129 of the manual.

Good luck !

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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:12 pm 
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Marker Magician
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Posts: 3490
Machine type: AW2400
Yes, you should be taking a stereo signal from your keys to a pair of tracks. Your low end will go left and the higher keys to the right, with the middle filled with - you guessed it- the middle keys. You may want to pan the keys L- 0 and r - 16, as this will place you keys more to one side. Keys spread right across sometimes sound "too big" - depends on the material and the patch you are using on the keys.

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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:03 am 
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Robbie The Botkiller
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A short notice: I have experienced that using the move command while source and target overlap might result in corrupt files. Therefore my advice would be to use the insert command at the very beginning of one of the tracks.

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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:33 am 
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Lone Star

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:11 pm
Posts: 7
Cheers for the feedback guys.

For the last 10 years I've too busy writing & recording songs that I never really took time learn
how to get the best sound from my recordings. I have a yamaha keyboard, boss gt8 guitar pedal & the G
& its only now Im starting to really learn what their capabilities are.

Anyway, my keyboard does not have a left & right output, it only has one output, so I used a Y cable to connect the keyboard to tracks 9 & 10 & hey presto, my keyboard is in stereo.

I'm sure Im going to be asking a lot of questions over the next few weeks/months,
Questions I should have asked years ago....................

Thanks for the help.


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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:22 pm 
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Tinhorn

Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:50 am
Posts: 317
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Retuned wrote:
Anyway, my keyboard does not have a left & right output, it only has one output, so I used a Y cable to connect the keyboard to tracks 9 & 10 & hey presto, my keyboard is in stereo.

Hi Retuned,
If keyboard output is mono than splitting Y cable will not make it stereo. Unless it is stereo type on a single output (Tip/ring/sleeve type jack for example).
It would help if you tell us what model is your keyboard, because most of them are stereo today... Or is it ancient piece..?


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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:52 pm 
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Lone Star

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:11 pm
Posts: 7
The Keyboard is a Yamaha PSR 550.
The Keyboard itself is in stereo, when you plug head phones directly into the keyboard you can hear that its in Stereo.
The Y Cable has definitely spead the Keyboard sound over the two speakers (stereo).
Since changing to the Y Cable when I use a Drum Kit setting on the Keyboard the Kit panned, cymbals & Toms are panned like it should be.


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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 4:12 pm 
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Footswitch Genius
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Location: Perth, Western Australia
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why don't you try double-tracking? this is a very common trick used by guitarists and vocalists, but there's no real reason it shouldn't work for keys too

simply record a track on e.g. track 9, pan it left. then record the track again, but this time on track 10 panned right. the (hopefully subtle) differences in your timing on each track gives it a dynamic stereo field. obviously this wouldn't work if you merely copied track 9 to track 10 - it needs to be two separate takes in order to work

pros and cons - it sounds much more alive than the simpler time-move method mentioned above, but it highlights timing errors in your playing and is thus more demanding of your musicianship. and it means playing the part twice instead of once. but it can sound quite good.

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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 4:26 pm 
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Lone Star

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:11 pm
Posts: 7
Clivewil, double tracking is exactly what I've been doing for the last ten years.
I've been using it for guitars, vocals, keys.
It works well & fills out the sound, however I just wasn't getting the sound I wanted to hear.


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 Post subject: Re: Sound Width
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 6:29 pm 
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HamelnStock Survivor and Midi Guru
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Hi Retuned.

I had a PSR 55O for some time. What you need is a Headphone to two mono jack convertors. Record both left and right at the same time with that and see all your problems fade away. Any decent music shop should be able to help you with that. You will still benefit from the double tracking thing.

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